Congo tetra pop-eye problems..treatment?

[bonsai dave]

Hi there what is your ph at . I have seen this with discus some time when there is a ph crash it happens. How often do you change water and how much? Epson salts won't much for the eye. It's great for stomach problems and open wounds. How long has the fish had the eye problem. It only lasted a few days for me.

[AquaSox]

To be honest bonsai....I haven't tested the pH in long time. I used to have pH meter hooked up but probe is toast now. Tank is non-CO2, but I guess the pH could still crash somehow. Will test when I can.

Eye problems have been chronic and are popping up in formerly healthy fish. They persist for very long time. I've had one affected fish for almost 5 months. Fish discoloration and dropsy follow after the initial eye problem. Some just start off with a "classic" popeye appearance unlike the picture I have posted.

What did your pH drop to? Are you injecting CO2? And how did you correct it? Baking soda/ buffers?

Thanks

[effox]

Test for PH *AND* your KH levels. Low KH could indicate PH swings.

Cheers,
Chris

[April]

I'd say ph crash or ammonia. If your gh and ph fall then your filter cannot get rid of ammonia. Hence the white eye. If you have tried every medicine like you say...I'd say you could also be killing your filter off.
Bonsai is right ph crash causes the white eye. If your getting Popeyes then you aren't keying your tank clean enough. If you have alot of substrate and dead spots etc you can get anaerobic spots also.
I'd do a good vacuuming and wc and add one tablespoon per 10 gallons. If you have a planted tank and these problems have been going on for quite some time I'd pull the plants..keep in a separate container for a few days with lights and air and do a very good cleaning.
Stress brings on problems. Maybe you need more water circulation also.


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[AquaSox]

It is possible antibiotics could have killed at least some of the filter bacteria. Although the tank is quite heavily planted....I'm not sure ammonia would be that much of an issue.

The tank is kept very clean in terms of water changes. 50% volume every 2 weeks. Substrate is a mix of fluorite and silica sand. Fluorite is separated from sand via barrier though. I generally do not vacuum the sand except superficially because the syphon tends to suck it up.

I have heard of anaerobic pockets forming in sand. Could be the case, but how would you prevent that? Constant disturbance? Like turning over sand?

I run 2 canisters filter one XP3 and one Eheim Ecco. Flow should not be a problem.

[jobber604]

Are you running co2 and leaving it on at night?

[AquaSox]

Here is an udate to the eye problems. Euthanized a few fish. Recently new case appeared in one female with possilby another male exhibiting symptoms.

Issues Addressed:

-2 months ago I found pH had crashed to 4 (measured with PinPoint pH probe).
Solution: added Kent pH Stable and increased pH to 6.75 with kH at 3. pH has stabilized.
-Ammonia has tested consistently at undetectable levels
-Did more frequent water changes early on to correct pH problem. Rate now at once per week @ 50% tank volume.
-Added new bulb to UV sterilizer and its been running constant.


Things I haven't ruled out:

1) Silica Sand from Lordco Autoparts. Possible anaerobic pockets or something else in sand.

2) Plastic tupperware containers used to separated Fluorite substrate from sand.Supposedly BPA free. Possible toxicity to leaching of chemicals.

3) gH

4) pathogens


Note: I used to have pure Fluorite and previous to that pure gravel. Never ever had any problems with popeye and have kept other congo tetras for many years without disease issues. I don't think age of the fish is playing a role here as every case is usually some form of eye issue always evolving into popeye. Some have gotten dropsy too.



Going to try adjusting gH:

Should I increase the gH using both Calcium Chloride and Epsom salt (both of which I have)? And to what levels/ratios? What should final gH be?
Alternatively I can use Seachem Equilibrium. Again what would the dosing recommendations be?

[gklaw]

Woow, I admire your patience for the 9 month problem. pH of 4 sounds crazy, I would recommend cross-check the calibration with a liquid test kit.

Not sure if the 50% WC change will be helpful at this stage. I would try 30% weekly or twice a week - less stressful. If they have been stressed for months, I am not sure how long it will take them to recover.

I would also make sure the filters are regularly maintained.

Also not sure it is a good idea of putting a coarse media under a fine media in a FW environment. In SW, that's how we create an anaerobic zone - I think that theory might have gone by the way side. I took that down in my SW years ago.

[AquaSox]

Woow, I admire your patience for the 9 month problem. pH of 4 sounds crazy, I would recommend cross-check the calibration with a liquid test kit.

I don't have a liquid test kit, but the pH probe was brand new 2 months ago and calibrated when bought. I've never seen a pH of 4 either. Even in other setups with un-buffered CO2 injection it would never go below 5.5.

Also not sure it is a good idea of putting a coarse media under a fine media in a FW environment. In SW, that's how we create an anaerobic zone - I think that theory might have gone by the way side. I took that down in my SW years ago.

The Fluorite is not mixed with sand. It is separated by plastic containers. However, most of the tank is sand.


Any recommendations for gH (as above)?