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Experiences with Callamanus worms and Solutions

This is a discussion on Experiences with Callamanus worms and Solutions within the Hospital Section forums, part of the Aquarium Related Chat category; Originally Posted by RD. The 5gr dosage rate originates from Charles Harrison, who is a chemist/ fish hobbyist, that sells ...

  1. #11
    Forum Novice ibenu's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by RD. View Post

    The 5gr dosage rate originates from Charles Harrison, who is a chemist/ fish hobbyist, that sells Levasimole HCl, not a VMD that specializes in treating tropical fish. (such as Dr. Roy Yanong) Dr. Yanong's bio/credentials can be found in the following link. Roy P. Yanong

    It appears that Charles Harrison got his dosage rate years back from an apisto hobbyist (Ken Laidlaw), that as far as I could gather also has no real qualifications for treating fish for disease beyond the hobbyist level.
    Considering his information/dosage was determined with and by the Veterinary services director Dr. Martin G. Greenwell (chicago aquarium) and this along with other references is viewable in his papers Id back off on the smack talk regarding him having no real qualifications to advice beyond hobbits levels.

    The Site you are referencing dr yanong, said that dewormers should be effective, yet many anecdotal evidence suggests this nematode is resistant to other treatments besides levamisole HC.

    What pat has works and I think members would be best served using a proven method versus a dewormer in general. Best of luck to everybody dealing with this nematode as it can take months to show it's self ( and we sell buy and trade fish amongst ourselves) looks like we are in for other course of seeing the nasty bugger in out tanks. Its extra tough that you can do QT for even 8 weeks and see no evidence of these guys lurking internally...

    Pat is there a way to diagnose this prior to the nematodes protruding? Would faecal slides show anything?

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    RD.
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    I never implied that Levamisole HC, doesn't work, there is no argument that for the nematode in question it is absolutely the treatment of choice.

    If you would like to question the dosage rate, and qualifications of Dr. Yanong from the U of Florida that's certainly your prerogative, but the reality is his dosage rate (2ppm of Levasimole HCl ) has been proven to be very effective, and IME (and many others) it is much safer on aquatic life.

    BTW - referencing someone else's work (or credentials) doesn't make one more qualified in an area such as this. I meant no disrespect towards Charles Harrison, I was merely pointing out the fact that he his a chemist by trade, not a VMD. I certainly don't consider myself qualified to suggest dosage rates for this type of treatment (or any others), but the Dr. that I linked to is considered by his peers to be an expert in this field. If you don't agree with his suggested dosage rate, feel free to take it up with him.

    Cheers

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    You know what would be a great science fair project for an inspired and brilliant young hobbyist? A dip stick test for nematodes or capillaria or bacterial infections. It would be so useful to be able to just stick a strip of paper into the water and know if it's likely safe or caution is advised.


    [QUOTE=ibenu; Would faecal slides show anything?[/QUOTE]

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    Forum Novice ibenu's Avatar
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    Did not mean to come across so harsh, again hopes we can get on this before it is many of out tanks AGAIN.. as we had an outbreak throughout many hobbists not too many years back and it was tragic..

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    Quote Originally Posted by ibenu View Post

    Pat is there a way to diagnose this prior to the nematodes protruding? Would faecal slides show anything?
    That's a good question. I'm not sure as I don't know much about the live history of the parasite. My guess is that there isn't a way in the faecal matter as from what I have read, when you see the worms sticking out of the fish's anus is when the worms are in it's reproductive stages. So, while still inside the fish before it reaches reproductive stages you'll likely not see any worms or signs of it unless the worms somehow looses it's grip inside the fish.

    Also (since I don't know much about it's live history), I'm not sure if it's live birth of baby worms or if the worms lay eggs. Either way, I'd think that it would be release into the water when they are sticking out of the fish and not while still inside.

    Perhaps when the fish is infected it releases some sort of hormone in the water? or maybe the worms release something in the water (besides eggs/babies) that we can test with? If this is true, it would be quite expensive to do this as you'd need VERY sensitive tests as they are such tiny organisms in a VERY large tank.
    Last edited by Mykiss; 10-02-2011 at 11:20 PM.

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    RD.
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    There are numerous Camallanus nematode species, so a lot of the info surrounding this worm will depend on the species involved. Gerry (Gobies et al) put together a good write up on this subject over on AA. (last post)
    One fish dead, another on its way - AlbertaAquatica

    Gerry had also experienced some serious stress issues in her fish when using the larger dosage rate (as in it killing fish), as have myself & others, hence the reason why I posted the previous info regarding Dr. Yanong's recommended dosage rate. (2ppm) It doesn't matter how effective a medication is, if it not only kills the nematodes, but it also kills the host. (as in your fish)

    I've only had to deal with this once when importing fish from overseas, but it's nasty business, and very deadly if not treated immediately.

    Hope the info in the link above helps.

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    I just want to add something from the experience I just had.

    I treated all my tanks with Levamisole HCl - 1 ml per gallon. The adult fish seems fine, even the one that was very infected, he has 4 worms sticking out of him for several hours after the treatment. So far I lost no fish, but 2 tiny babies.
    What I didn't expect was that almost all my cherry shrimps died I lost about 10 (out of 20) in the first 12-18 hours and the rest of them 36 hours later look bad, hardly move at all, so I suspect I will lose them as well
    So, just according to my experience, treat the shrimps with care as it doesn't seem it is safe for them as expected.

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    I just noticed these buggers in my tank again

    Im wondering if I should consider the eggs that one of my females is holding toast? Also I have 5 1.5" youngens in there as well, will they be ok?

    Thanks!

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    I lost just 2 tiny babies during the initial treatment. The big fish and bigger babies were OK.
    Good luck!

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    Defaultworm problem

    just seeing if you still have any de worming medification thanks vic my email is vicjames1971@yahoo.com
    Last edited by vic; 08-15-2011 at 05:53 PM.

 

 
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