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Discussion Starter · #1 · (Edited)
Hi Grant (and anyone else who can help ;),

We picked up some fish at your Burnaby store on Sunday. Unfortunately, the two Clown Loaches we purchased are now showing signs of Ich infestation.

We talked to one of the reps in your store today who suggested API Super Ick Cure. I asked about potential live plant issues, as our tank (60gal) is heavily planted, and was told that Super Ick Cure shouldn't be an issue with the plants. I ended up with the powder version.

When I got home this evening I did a quick search online and found that a lot people are suggesting that Super Ick Cure (Malachite Green/Nitrofurazone) is in fact very hard on plants.

I guess my first question is whether or not I can use this treatment without risking our live plants. My second question would be what other alternatives can any of you suggest? I've nudged the heater up to 82, and we do have a 9-watt UV inline with the filter, but the bulb may not be up to the task of sterilizing as we haven't changed it in a while.

As an FYI - I took a quick look at the tank instore, and although your staff told me they didn't see any Ick-y fish in the tank, I'm pretty sure there were spots on some of the others in there. The small Clown Loaches, tank FW116.
 

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Sorry to hear you have been hit with Ich. Thy are very sensitive to it when they are first introduced.
The Malachite is not the best on plants. Basically any med that stains can harm plants, my apologies for the recommendation. Some people have used Aquarisol at 1/2 dose, although it is soluble copper salts I have used it with plants many times with no ill effects. Salt often works as well but is hard on plants. The UV bulb being replaced would really help, or I would recommend the Aquarisol.
I hope everything works out, let me know how things go.
 

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I recently treated ick in my 125 gallon fairly heavily planted tank by raising tank temp up to 86 F and using Quick Cure (not the stuff you got). The tank is CO2 injected, but none of the plants are delicate (java fern, jungle vals and Anubias) After a week, all ick was gone and my plants looked fine. I think I'd be more concerned about the loaches than the plants (I only used a half dose because my tank is full of fancy plecos). Hope it clears up for you soon.
 

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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
I recently treated ick in my 125 gallon fairly heavily planted tank by raising tank temp up to 86 F and using Quick Cure (not the stuff you got). The tank is CO2 injected, but none of the plants are delicate (java fern, jungle vals and Anubias) After a week, all ick was gone and my plants looked fine. I think I'd be more concerned about the loaches than the plants (I only used a half dose because my tank is full of fancy plecos). Hope it clears up for you soon.
Actually, my first concern is all the other fish. The tank is well established. A bunch of smaller assorted Tetras, a pair of Angelfish, a catfish, gold zigzag pleco, "normal" pleco (a rare find that DOESN'T eat our plants), some Rams (Golden and Bolivian), some Otto Cats...

So yeah, first priority is preventing the spread of Ick to all the other fish.

Second would be defeating the Ick (thereby saving the Loaches) without defeating our plants.
 

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Unfortunately, without knowing what catfishes you have, I am hesitant to tell you which route of treatment you should take (catfish, zigzag and normal pleco don't tell me what they are, except you have 3 catfish + the Otos). Maybe Grant can help further.
 

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When you get ich, when a fish has it, you cannot really save those fish, they just have to battle it out. What you are doing is preventing other fish from getting it. Salt, ich meds, UV sterilizers, turning a heat up a notch... all things that could help a bit.
 

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BDG,
Lets go through this completely. Raising the temp to 82 but no higher than 84 will speed up the life cycle of the parasite and get it off the fish faster, once the parasite falls off it is no longer a threat. The baby Ich however is. That is when the medication is effective, at that stage. Any med at half dose will probably work, but your best bet of not affecting the plants is as I say the Aquarisol. Dose 1/2 dose daily for 5 days or as recommended. This varies from med to med. A small amount of salt would not hurt if you have Aquarium Salt. Maybe a third dose will be tolerated by the plants and cats.
Ich is very common in Clown Loaches, but, once the Ich is gone, the Loacahes will be less likely to get infected again. It is stress at this point. Can you post your water parameters? I am most interested in GH, KH, and Nitrate.
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 · (Edited)
BDG,
Lets go through this completely. Raising the temp to 82 but no higher than 84 will speed up the life cycle of the parasite and get it off the fish faster, once the parasite falls off it is no longer a threat. The baby Ich however is. That is when the medication is effective, at that stage. Any med at half dose will probably work, but your best bet of not affecting the plants is as I say the Aquarisol. Dose 1/2 dose daily for 5 days or as recommended. This varies from med to med. A small amount of salt would not hurt if you have Aquarium Salt. Maybe a third dose will be tolerated by the plants and cats.
Ich is very common in Clown Loaches, but, once the Ich is gone, the Loacahes will be less likely to get infected again. It is stress at this point. Can you post your water parameters? I am most interested in GH, KH, and Nitrate.
Agreed on many points.

I've upped the water temp to 82~83, based on what I read about the Ick overall life cycle being shorter at these temps. I vacced the gravel this evening too prior to starting treatment...

We are dosing 1/2 dose with another med (Victoria Green/Acriflavine) that said specifically it was "Safe for Freshwater Aquarium Fish and Plants." We also have the UV running (as always) as I mentioned before.

Regrettably, we don't have the tests to provide you with GH, or KH numbers, but Nitrate is between 5.0-10.0 ppm (~8.0 if I had to guess) and PH is generally always between 6.8-7.0 --- buffered with a crushed coral filter bag in our filter. Our tank has been "established" for about 2 years. We donated 3 larger Bala's (5-7") about 4 months ago, and were looking to 'fill in the gaps' with the new acquisitions.

To get this out in the open, all of our fish livestock has come from your Big Al's/Island Pets Unlimited stores. We've never had an issue previously with any of the fish from either of your locations. But as I said, when I was in the store today asking for help with an Ich remedy for the fish purchased on Sunday, I checked the tank our Clown Loaches came from and of the ~30 remaining, I could clearly see white spots on at least 5-10 of them -- you had to crouch down (low tank) and wait for them to stand still for a second or two, but the spots are there...

I don't feel this is an issue with our water - or the stress of being moved - and I think the fact that I can see spots on the fish still remaining in FW116 speaks to my point... Our tank is established, and we haven't had any Ick issues prior. Further, we purchased 2 Discus, 2 Clown Loaches, and 4 Khuli Loaches on Sunday. The Clown Loaches from the same tank I mentioned earlier in this thread are the only fish exhibiting symptoms, and they were the only fish I witnessed today instore with the same issue.

BDG, can you move your fish to another tank for treatment and let the planted tank go without any fish for awhile?
Not really. We have an old 20gal tank in storage... But it wouldn't handle the fish we have now. Maybe as a really really REALLY short-term (ie MOVING) solution, but not for a few days...
 

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I will take a look at the tank in question tomorrow. It is possible that they have started to get a bit of Ich, as I say, they are Ich magnets. Particularly with shipping stress etc. The system has four tanks of Clown Loaches on it and two of the tanks have had Clown Loaches for at least 3 weeks.
I will check with Chris in the morning as well and check their status. Depending on the age of that UV bulb you are running it may have a negative effect on the med. As a precaution I would unplug the UV bulb. If it is old it is not going to be effective against the Ich anyways but may de stabilize the med.

The clown loaches in FW116 have only been there for roughly 5 days from the day you purchased them. Again I will have a look and get back to you tomorrow.
 

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I've used quick cure at half strength for clown loaches, cories, and many varities of tetras with no losses. The tank was CO2 injected and I kept the lights on with the normal photoperiod. This is your best option IMHO. I have never had success using Aquarisol. Fraser Aquarium and King Ed both sell Quick Cure. I raised my temp to 82 during the treatment and usually do a 10 - 14 day treatment as an insurance policy.

Good luck with the treatment.

Stuart
 

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You may try Kordon Ich Attack and free of formalin & machilite green.

# 100% Organic Herbals Based On Naphthoquinones For Fresh and Saltwater Aquarium and Pond Conditions
# Helps Prevent And Treat Single-Celled External Fish Diseases Caused By White Spot Disease (Ich), Other Protozoans, Dinoflagellates, and Fungus
# Equally Effective In Fresh And Salt Water
# Does Not Require Water Changes Between Treatments
# Safe For Use With Aquatic Invertebrates (Snails, Shrimp, Crabs, Coral, Anemones, etc.)

http://www.novalek.com/kordon/ich_attack/index.htm

Hope this helps
 

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You may try Kordon Ich Attack and free of formalin & machilite green.

# 100% Organic Herbals Based On Naphthoquinones For Fresh and Saltwater Aquarium and Pond Conditions
# Helps Prevent And Treat Single-Celled External Fish Diseases Caused By White Spot Disease (Ich), Other Protozoans, Dinoflagellates, and Fungus
# Equally Effective In Fresh And Salt Water
# Does Not Require Water Changes Between Treatments
# Safe For Use With Aquatic Invertebrates (Snails, Shrimp, Crabs, Coral, Anemones, etc.)

http://www.novalek.com/kordon/ich_attack/index.htm

Hope this helps
I'll second that suggestion, Ich Attach is a great medicine for sensitive fish. I've found that most other medicines are copper based and are just too harsh on scaleless fish like clown loaches. The other thing that can help you a lot is to move the sick fish into a clean tank before medicating. By doing this you leave behind all of the ich parasites which are in other stages and only bring over the ones attached to the sick fish.

I had a shipment of 20 Amazon puffers (another sensitive fish) get Ich a few days after they came in. I moved 5 to a clean tank, leaving the other 15 in the "sick tank", and medicated both tanks with Ich Attack. Survival in the clean tank was 5 for 5, whereas only 1 of the 15 made it in the sick tank.

Good luck!
 

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I fully agree with Grant's suggestion to use Aquari-Sol. I have used this, full strength, with very sensitive fish (wild caught characins including pencilfish and wild caught corys) in well-planted aquaria and it has cured the ich (also worked on velvet) without damaging any plants and not one fish fatality.

Although it is copper-based, and the afore-mentioned fish are extremely sensitive to copper when above trace element level (as are plants for that matter), the fish showed considerably less agitation than with any other meds I have used in the past. After five days the corys do begin to respirate more heavily, but a 50% water change resolved that. The ich has never returned (nor did the velvet).

I would never use any other parasite medication with sensitive fish, and as i said there was absolutely no change in the plants. I also did not raise the temperature since this is additional stress on such fish; there are corydoras species that would be severely affected and possibly killed by temps of 82F or higher.

Byron.
 

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Discussion Starter · #16 ·
Hello again,

So far the Ich treatment has been going alright. The loaches no longer bear any signs of Ich, and all fish and plants have survived.

However, I got home from work today to discover what I think may be some kind of fungus on one of our Angelfish. Just when I thought everything was settling back to normal...

It's a patch about the size of an eraser on the end of a pencil. It's on her side, and it has a noticeably white border all the way around, and then really fine fuzz/fungus/mold(?) growing inside the white border. It reaches out about 2-3mm in "growth".

Here it is. Sorry for pic quality:



 

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Hello again,

So far the Ich treatment has been going alright. The loaches no longer bear any signs of Ich, and all fish and plants have survived.

However, I got home from work today to discover what I think may be some kind of fungus on one of our Angelfish. Just when I thought everything was settling back to normal...

It's a patch about the size of an eraser on the end of a pencil. It's on her side, and it has a noticeably white border all the way around, and then really fine fuzz/fungus/mold(?) growing inside the white border. It reaches out about 2-3mm in "growth".

Here it is. Sorry for pic quality:



Hello fungus! He has sustained an injury somehow and it has become infected with a fungal bacteria. Pima fix would be your mildest option, all natural but it will take a little while to clear up. It will only affect the damaged tissue so don't worry about it spreading to other fish. Think of it as an infected cut on your hand. Pima fix is a good choice also because it will not react with other meds present. He will be fine, good luck!
 

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Discussion Starter · #18 ·
Thanks,

Pima Fix has been added to the tank. It says it's safe for all fish, but I don't think the Khuli Loaches are liking it too much. They became extremely active after it was added, swimming all over the place, and now they're clustering in the top corners of the tank... Usually they sit at the bottom of the tank, underneath plants and whatnot.
 

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How much Pimafix do you use in a very small bowl?
I put my betta in a small bowl (the same as they are in when they are on display in IPU) which holds about 3 cups of water = 0.1875 gal. The instructions on the bottle say one teaspoon per 10 gallons. So about 0. 2 gallons would take 1/50 of a teaspoon? How do you measure that? Is that about two drops or something?
 

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Sigh... i just read all the post... i've been battling ich for the last 2 weeks now! Extremely extremely dissapointed, cause it's CONSTANTLY gonig and coming back, haven't used meds, but I've decided I got no choice now... my favourite angel fish just past away =(
only problem here is... is my filter shrimp going to be safe with aquarisol?
 
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