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Discussion Starter #21
Greet post but as of Monday you do need permits for discus and possibly a vet check that has to be booked . Their vet and pay the vet check.
It's in transition and this week was the last week for no permits.
As tony said check the list.
Lots of unsuspecting fish are on it . Tiger barbs, Gouramis, zebra danio, guppies, goldfish, discus, etc etc.
Thanks for your input April. Like you said you gotta keep checking the rules. It will only get harder down the road for both personal and commercial importers. I hope it won't be but I'm a skeptic with government. Sadly half of the government staff don't seem to know their own rules when you call.
 

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Discussion Starter #22
Great write up.

I have not importe fish is other than driving across the boreder with some and telling the agent.
got the go ahead<G>

the secret to remember with customs YOU are GUILTY until you prove your innocence.

I hate saying "Yes Sir" so some guy waring a 9 mm.
Yes I've driven fish across many times myself. Just be honest and declare. At the road crossings I've never been asked for anything besides tax. But with things changing you never know. The government keeps tossing fish regs between CBSA and CFIA. The borders being controlled by CBSA. So confusing even to them and me.
 

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Ok well pet Importation is simpler than commercial. The one clause is you are meant to keep them for a year. Which tony is . You did your homework very well tony.
So people buying, selling, flipping...this isn't the way it should be done.
Transshipped, resellers, wholesalers there's alot more involved. The process started well over the last couple of years and the deadline was extended as they didn't have things in place yet. As of feb 4th the permits had to be ready . Permits for each supplier .
I believe they also have limits for personal use. It used to be 60 fish. Otherwise...most likely you aren't keeping them for yourself. If your importing for breeding its also not considered personal.
Just read your last post tony. Yes they extended it to February from December as customs didn't know what's going on yet. From department to department getting everyone on the same page took time. I'm sure there is more tweaking.
I'm also sure there will be more species listed and some banned . Here's some I heard they are thinking on. Of course. Snakeheads..then I heard weather loaches...and here's one...white cloud minnows! Whoa...scary! But their idea was they can live outdoors..I told the person from ubc well...if anything they would be in someone's barrel on their deck..not likely someone would say we can't keep them anymore and throw them in a lake. There were a few others also. Don't remember.
We are still lax compared to Australia where thry need a two week quarantine at an acquis registered quarantine center with their own staff. Paid and renting of the space. If disease is found the shipment is destroyed. My friend had one whole shipment of discus destroyed. Of course the supplier from Singapore didn't replace as he said no disease when he sent...a costly loss. Considering most shipments with shipping is about 8 grand .
 

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Discussion Starter #25
Thanks April. This post was purely meant for people importing for their own use. If people want to go and commercially import, then by all means, do your research and start a biz and become a sponsor here! :D

The way I see it, if you can't get the fish locally, that's no reason not to be able to go and get it yourself. I think in my old age, I just can't settle for no for an answer.

Ok well pet Importation is simpler than commercial. The one clause is you are meant to keep them for a year. Which tony is . You did your homework very well tony.
So people buying, selling, flipping...this isn't the way it should be done.
Transshipped, resellers, wholesalers there's alot more involved. The process started well over the last couple of years and the deadline was extended as they didn't have things in place yet. As of feb 4th the permits had to be ready . Permits for each supplier .
I believe they also have limits for personal use. It used to be 60 fish. Otherwise...most likely you aren't keeping them for yourself. If your importing for breeding its also not considered personal.
Just read your last post tony. Yes they extended it to February from December as customs didn't know what's going on yet. From department to department getting everyone on the same page took time. I'm sure there is more tweaking.
I'm also sure there will be more species listed and some banned . Here's some I heard they are thinking on. Of course. Snakeheads..then I heard weather loaches...and here's one...white cloud minnows! Whoa...scary! But their idea was they can live outdoors..I told the person from ubc well...if anything they would be in someone's barrel on their deck..not likely someone would say we can't keep them anymore and throw them in a lake. There were a few others also. Don't remember.
We are still lax compared to Australia where thry need a two week quarantine at an acquis registered quarantine center with their own staff. Paid and renting of the space. If disease is found the shipment is destroyed. My friend had one whole shipment of discus destroyed. Of course the supplier from Singapore didn't replace as he said no disease when he sent...a costly loss. Considering most shipments with shipping is about 8 grand .
 

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It's pretty difficult to keep fish in Australia because of the importation laws. But then of course it's like that for all pets there. A guy on planetcatish talked about how he paid almost $100 for an L128 which was a juvie.....if I had to do that, I don't think I'd be keep any fancy fish, maybe just local creek fishes.
 

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Tony...your post on importing fish was one of the most comprehensive bits of info that i have seen on this site or any other site, for that matter. Your personal experience, advice and attention to detail was top notch. I thoroughly enjoyed reading about your experience and i thank you for the information. Well done!
 

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Greet post but as of Monday you do need permits for discus and possibly a vet check that has to be booked . Their vet and pay the vet check.
It's in transition and this week was the last week for no permits.
As tony said check the list.
Lots of unsuspecting fish are on it . Tiger barbs, Gouramis, zebra danio, guppies, goldfish, discus, etc etc.
Hi April - I checked the government list of controlled fish looking for tiger barbs, Puntius tetrazonasite Susceptible Species of Aquatic Animals - Animals - Canadian Food Inspection Agency and could not find them listed; I did see a fish called the "pool barb" or Puntius sophore. Looks like we all need to know some Latin now when we go to clear fish through customs. :)

Great write-up Tony.
 

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Discussion Starter #29
Thanks guys. Reading the regulations will make your head spin. Like I mentioned before, the CBSA officer that I saw appeared pretty clueless when I mentioned that I did not need a permit. I held my ground and she cleared it. So they are just as confused as we are. I'm sure their staff are real pleased with having to administer another layer of documents for another department. That's likely why you rarely if ever get asked when you cross by land. Air clearance is much more formal. They can't just wave you through.
 

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So I would just like to double check with you guys on this. "Aquatic animals that are brought into Canada must be declared and in the case of aquatic animals on the susceptible species list, must have an import permit unless otherwise exempt." Does that mean if I wanted to import a few fish that are hard to get here and isn't listed on any of those websites I would just have to declare it and nothing more? Like I just have to go there, collect my fish and do some declaration and pay some taxes?
 

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If the fish you want to import is not on Schedule III then you only need to provide a few details.

Aquatic Animals not Listed in Schedule III

194. No person shall import an aquatic animal that is not listed in Schedule III unless it is accompanied by a document that is satisfactory to an inspector and that includes the following information:
(a) the name and address of the exporter;
(b) the name and address of the importer;
(c) the taxonomic name of the aquatic animal, the life stage, and the number being imported, if more than one; and
(d) the country in which the aquatic animal was born or where the germplasm came from and, in the case of an aquatic animal, whether it was born in captivity or in the wild.
SOR/2010-296, s. 4.


For fish listed on Schedule III then you can import them if they are one of the 14 listed in the regulation as long as you fill out the proper owners deceleration.

Importation of Aquatic Animals

Aquatic Animals Listed in Schedule III

191. No person shall import an aquatic animal listed in Schedule III except in accordance with a permit issued under section 160.
SOR/2010-296, s. 4.

Pet Aquatic Animals

192. (1) Despite section 191, an aquatic animal listed in Schedule III may be imported without a permit for use as a pet if
(a) the aquatic animal is a member of one of the following species, namely, Barbonymus gonionotus, Carassius auratus, Colisa lalia, Danio rerio, Glossogobius giuris, Osphronemus goramy, Oxyeleotris marmorata, Poecilia reticulata, Puntius sophore, Symphysodon discus, Toxotes chatareus, Trichogaster pectoralis or Trichogaster trichopterus;
(b) the aquatic animal has not been taken to a show or display outside Canada;
(c) the aquatic animal is imported by its owner;
(d) the aquatic animal is accompanied or picked up by its owner at the point of entry into Canada; and
(e) the owner presents proof of the owner's identity and his or her ownership of the aquatic animal to the inspector.
(2) An aquatic animal imported under subsection (1) shall be kept in an aquarium in the household of its owner, and the owner shall not, for the year following the importation, expose it to any aquatic animals other than those kept in the household.
(3) The owner of an aquatic animal imported under subsection (1) shall not, in the period of 90 days after the importation, import another aquatic animal under that subsection.
(4) The owner of an aquatic animal imported under subsection (1) shall keep the records of the importation, including the documents required under paragraph (1)(e).
SOR/2010-296, s. 4.


I think the following section deals with fish that are dead and being brought across the border to be eaten, even though it doesn't clearly state this.
If you were bringing back 10 or less you could try and argue the fact.
Not sure how far you may get.
Not worth the hassle in my opinion.

Aquatic Animals for Personal Use

193. (1) Despite section 191, an aquatic animal listed in Schedule III may be imported without a permit if
(a) the aquatic animal is imported by a person for his or her personal use;
(b) the person brings the aquatic animal into Canada or picks it up at the point of entry into Canada; and
(c) the person presents, to the inspector, proof of his or her identity and proof of the manner in which he or she acquired the aquatic animal.
(2) The quantity of aquatic animals that may be imported under subsection (1) shall not exceed
(a) four crustaceans;
(b) three kilograms of molluscs; and
(c) ten finfish that are not eviscerated.


Link to schedule III
Health of Animals Regulations
 

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Discussion Starter #32
Busy boy Dave even while enjoying the sun!

So I would just like to double check with you guys on this. "Aquatic animals that are brought into Canada must be declared and in the case of aquatic animals on the susceptible species list, must have an import permit unless otherwise exempt." Does that mean if I wanted to import a few fish that are hard to get here and isn't listed on any of those websites I would just have to declare it and nothing more? Like I just have to go there, collect my fish and do some declaration and pay some taxes?
As with any time you have to bring stuff over the border, YMMV. As many of us have seen, most times, the customs agents are unclear as to the regulations and what must be done. But essentially, your statement is correct. If the fish are not on any of the lists, then do your due diligence, make sure you ensure you have appropriate scientific names on the invoices and then you should be fine. As I said, that doesn't prevent customs from hassling you due to pure ignorance either. Good luck! We've done it several times ourselves now and have not had "real" issues other than some agents being unaware of the regulations causing much time spent at the border.
 
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would you mind sharing the costs associated with this importation? (other than the prices you paid for the fish)

thank you
 

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There's always costs associated with any endeavour.

Costs to pick up and clear customs:

Actual
-time (driving, time off work, waiting in line ups, pick up)
-gas
-wear and tear on car
-unfavourable exchange rate

Potential
-GST
-emotional energy dealing with csba
-more time to wait for csba agent to figure out the paperwork
-the health and stress of the fish during transport
-dead on arrivals which will lead to additional costs

That's why it's important to weigh the option between supporting your local LFS or going through this process as a last resort.

Sent from my mobile phone
 

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There's always costs associated with any endeavour.

Costs to pick up and clear customs:

Actual
-time (driving, time off work, waiting in line ups, pick up)
-gas
-wear and tear on car
-unfavourable exchange rate

Potential
-GST
-emotional energy dealing with csba
-more time to wait for csba agent to figure out the paperwork
-the health and stress of the fish during transport
-dead on arrivals which will lead to additional costs
I was more interested in the $$$ paid out for this, not time, gas, repairs to the car, lost wages since you went on a workday, stress, headaches, etc
 

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Other than the actual cost of the fish and the shipping from the supplier there was no other cost at all. If customs wanted to they could have charged tax and possibly duty (not sure at what rate)
But we were just waved thru.
 

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Discussion Starter #38
Yeah if I'm reading the rules correctly, it would have been hst and nothing more. Don't forget that this is personal importation, commercial importation may very well be different and have other costs involved like permits.
 

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So if CFIA ok with the fish you are getting to canada from US, by road there should be no problem crossing? Would it be better to say u are bringing pet fish? Than not saying anything? If the number of fish is just one or two?

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
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