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I have a 120G mixed African cichlid tank, 2 royal plecos, 2 L200's and 2 smaller plecos.

For filtration I'm running 2 AC110's and an Eheim 2229 wet dry. The parameters are perfectly fine but I'm having to clean the AC sponges (pleco poop clogs up everything) and vacuum/wc 30% every week. I
figure a sump will make it easier to clean plus give me longer intervals btwn cleaning.

Sooooo... Looking at designing a sump. Any opinions on HOB overflows appreciated.
 

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if i were to do it again, i would drill. but seeings how its an existing tank, i have a cpr. it has never failed or lost siphon. there is an air pump that you can get, but i dont have one and dont think you need it. i like my cpr

bailey
 

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I would have loved to drill, but that's not going to happen. I have a CPR and its works great. I had also picked up a a knock off from ebay for less than 1/2 price. It's designed the same and works the same way. All over flow box requires a primer usually a power head. I picked up something called a aqua lifter that works just as good. This way you don't have a powerhead in the tank.
 

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The CPR is a poor overflow design in not just my opinion but many others as well.

You absolutely do NOT need a air pump (which is prone to failure) to maintain a siphon. I know several people who have had disasters or near disasters with CPRs when either the air pump stopped or a piece of debris catches.

U-tube overflows work fine without air pumps and are far more reliable. The highest quality u-tube overflow is made by Lifereef - I used one for years without issue. There are cheaper alternatives from outfits like Amiracle and Hurricane out there as well.
 

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An overflow that requires any kind of pump to maintain the syphon is not designed properly.
U tube overflows like Lifereef are the only kind i have ever built or used myself.
I made my own and used them for almost 15 years without ever having a problem with them losing syphon.
They have a round tube that flows a lot more water through it, so, bubbles can't build up in it and stop the syphon.
The CPR has a wide flat syphon that flows water through it slower, so, bubbles can build up in it and cause it to stop.
That's why they recommend and have designed it to have a pump hooked up to it to suck the bubbles out and keep it going.
I have met more than a few CPR owners that were not happy with them.
If you got to Lifereef's website they have pictures of them.
 

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Discussion Starter #7
Seems there's fans of both U-tube and Siphon type overflows... in terms of noise which one is quieter?
 

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I would have loved to drill, but that's not going to happen. I have a CPR and its works great. I had also picked up a a knock off from ebay for less than 1/2 price. It's designed the same and works the same way. All over flow box requires a primer usually a power head. I picked up something called a aqua lifter that works just as good. This way you don't have a powerhead in the tank.
Looking back, drilling would have been nice. Hindsight is 20/20 tho :D

Although my 2229 does an excellent job of bio filtration, having a sump with all its options seems like the way to go now.
 

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They are both pretty quite.
The CRP may be a little quieter, but, only because there is not as much water running through it.
Most of the noise with an overflow box comes from the water emptying into the sump.
I used to work in a LFS that sold CPR's and I refuse to sell them to customers.
Other employees sold them and a lot of them came back or had unhappy owners.
 

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I must say that that primer\pump was quite the pain in the butt when I first got it. I will probably swith to the U-tube for my next setup (if I can't drill).

How effective is the surface skimming with the U-tube as that was one thing I noticed the CPR one does quite well.
 

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U tube overflows surface skim just as good, if not better than a CPR because they move more water through them.
 

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+1 on the U-tube style of overflows.

I've been using a dual-tube overflow on my 120 gallon for over 2 years. Has never failed on me, through multiple power outages and such it never loses siphon. When the return pump re-starts, the overflow just keeps flowing. No need for an aqualifter.

Mine is the Eshopps brand (PF1000) - a knock-off of the Lifereef ones I believe. I have read some mixed reviews of the Eshopps boxes, so their quality control might not be as good as Lifereef, which gets great reviews.

I like the idea of the dual-tube design too. I tested it, and in my set-up a single tube has enough capacity to keep up with my return pump, so even if one tube got blocked I wouldn't have a flood.
 

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Discussion Starter #13
+1 on the U-tube style of overflows.

I've been using a dual-tube overflow on my 120 gallon for over 2 years. Has never failed on me, through multiple power outages and such it never loses siphon. When the return pump re-starts, the overflow just keeps flowing. No need for an aqualifter.

Mine is the Eshopps brand (PF1000) - a knock-off of the Lifereef ones I believe. I have read some mixed reviews of the Eshopps boxes, so their quality control might not be as good as Lifereef, which gets great reviews.

I like the idea of the dual-tube design too. I tested it, and in my set-up a single tube has enough capacity to keep up with my return pump, so even if one tube got blocked I wouldn't have a flood.
Been looking at the Eshopps brand myself, and another even lesser known brand CFL http://cgi.ebay.com/AQUARIUM-OVERFLOW-BOX-DUAL-SUMP-WET-DRY-1200-GPH-/380232319264?cmd=ViewItem&pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item58879cc120#ht_500wt_956)

I think you guys sold me on the U-tube design... now looking at pumps :D

I was looking at Eheim, but they max out at 900GPH and are quite expensive so I'm looking at alternatives like this http://www.marineland.com/sites/Marineland/products/productdetail.aspx?id=2054&cid=3598&mid=3226

Is it better to buy a pump with a higher GPH and then use a ball valve to scale it down?
 

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I have this problem (30+ plecos in a 125 - see My Pleco Thread). IMO, a sump is not going to help you much. I think it would be easier logistically and cost wise to add/move your powerheads such that the detritus accumulates in one or two spots where you can easily see and gravel vac it. A sump with an overflow is not going to get the detritus on the bottom and you're going to gravel vac anyway, unless you are running undergravel jets already that drive the detritus up and you can accomplish the same with powerheads. So unless you can drive the detritus and draw from the bottom of the tank (especially for the Royals as they get bigger and rasp more wood), it'll still be a mess down there.
 

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Discussion Starter #15
I have this problem (30+ plecos in a 125 - see My Pleco Thread). IMO, a sump is not going to help you much. I think it would be easier logistically and cost wise to add/move your powerheads such that the detritus accumulates in one or two spots where you can easily see and gravel vac it. A sump with an overflow is not going to get the detritus on the bottom and you're going to gravel vac anyway, unless you are running undergravel jets already that drive the detritus up and you can accomplish the same with powerheads. So unless you can drive the detritus and draw from the bottom of the tank (especially for the Royals as they get bigger and rasp more wood), it'll still be a mess down there.
Someone who feels my pain LOL

I was actually planning on doing what you're describing. Taking a page out from the Saltwater guys and using a Hydor Koralia to direct the Royal poop into the overflow.

The morning after dropping in a few slices of yam the night before looks like a warzone... wood scrapings, pieces of yam and copious amounts of POOP.
 

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Yep, I feel your pain big time. 1 Royal, 5 L226's, so that's a lot of gnawing. Never mind the L128 and L200's. I just fed yam and asparagus last night and there are yam poop strips everywhere. I'm running an FX5, XP3, 2028, Koralia 1 and Koralia 2 24/7 plus an AC70 with venturi at night (because tank is planted heavily and CO2 injected) and it's still a big mess whenever I feed yams or zucchini.
 

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Seems there's fans of both U-tube and Siphon type overflows... in terms of noise which one is quieter?
A properly designed u-tube is very quiet provided the drain portion is properly designed. Look up "Durso standpipe" and "Stockman standpipe" and "Hofer gurgle buster".

I used a Stockman on my Lifereef.
 

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if you look at the design behind a HOB overflow, they are all the same. just a different design. the reason there is air in the overflow is cuse the volume the overflow can handle was not met by the return pump or the overflow was placed too close to the surface and created a vortex which sicked in air. which will cause a vacuum falure. the return pump was too small, the HOB was placed too close to the surface or the sump was too small. look at the picture, think about the disign, its a mathimatical equation and can not go wrong.

bailey
 
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